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+--- Thread: CAFE Mileage ratings... How would YOU react to 62mpg ? (/showthread.php?tid=104242)
Re: CAFE Mileage ratings... How would YOU react to 62mpg ? - Rick-o - 10-02-2010
Dakota wrote:
I don't know what these billions of subsidies are. That report doesn't help. Give me specifics. I understand ethanol subsidies, milk subsidies , farm price support etc. The oil subsidies you are talking about are 5 steps removed from the source. By that logic potato chips are subsidized because people eat them, get a heart attack, check in emergency room and somewhere along the line the government picks up the tab. So a bag of potato chips should cost $10.
Oh, one more thing. When we used to pay $1 for gas, Europeans were paying $5, and did that for 30 years. Nothing came out of Europe. Nothing. All they did was to retrench and do with less. We had to wait for 30 years for Japanese to think of hybrids. What proves your theory wrong is that we got the hybrids with $2.50 a gallon gas.
It's ok, we know you don't comprehend the issues being discussed here.
Re: CAFE Mileage ratings... How would YOU react to 62mpg ? - Grace62 - 10-02-2010
Here's a good run down on what constitutes subsidies for the oil industry:
"...the American oil and gas industry might receive anywhere between $15 billion and $35 billion a year in subsidies from taxpayers.
Why such a large margin of error? The exact number is slippery and hard to quantify, given the myriad of programs that can be broadly characterized as subsidies when it comes to fossil fuels. For instance, the U.S. government has generally propped the industry up with:
* Construction bonds at low interest rates or tax-free
* Research-and-development programs at low or no cost
* Assuming the legal risks of exploration and development in a company's stead
* Below-cost loans with lenient repayment conditions
* Income tax breaks, especially featuring obscure provisions in tax laws designed to receive little congressional oversight when they expire
* Sales tax breaks - taxes on petroleum products are lower than average sales tax rates for other goods
* Giving money to international financial institutions (the U.S. has given tens of billions of dollars to the World Bank and U.S. Export-Import Bank to encourage oil production internationally, according to Friends of the Earth)
* The U.S. Strategic Petroleum Reserve
* Construction and protection of the nation's highway system
* Allowing the industry to pollute - what would oil cost if the industry had to pay to protect its shipments, and clean up its spills? If the environmental impact of burning petroleum were considered a cost? Or if it were held responsible for the particulate matter in people's lungs, in liability similar to that being asserted in the tobacco industry?
* Relaxing the amount of royalties to be paid... '
Re: CAFE Mileage ratings... How would YOU react to 62mpg ? - Grace62 - 10-02-2010
Germans invented the hybrid engine over a century ago, did they not?
The US is the number one market for hybrids, and yes they became popular as gas prices rose and concern for the environment increased.
Can't believe you are beating up Europe over use of gasoline! Come on. Life in European cities was not designed around needing a car, as it was here. Cars are smaller and more energy efficient (about half of them are diesel, for example.) The typical vehicle on the highway in Europe is far more energy efficient than in the US. No comparison. Consumers have been sensitive to this for a long time and consider many sophisticated engine options...things American consumers are only beginning to consider when purchasing.
In a few decades we will use less gas per person, no question. Other countries got quite a jump start on that.
Re: CAFE Mileage ratings... How would YOU react to 62mpg ? - mattkime - 10-02-2010
62mpg sucks compared to what i get on my bike.
Re: CAFE Mileage ratings... How would YOU react to 62mpg ? - lafinfil - 10-02-2010
I would like to thank Dakota and all the good folks of his state (PA) for willingly paying higher state taxes that continues subsidize oil companies. These subsidies are a PA tradition and were enacted more than a century ago, when oil was first pulled out of a hole in Titusville in 1859.
In addition PA is building roads for the gas drillers so they can frack drill the Marcellus Shale, which is going to get you slightly cheaper NG (or not) So what if it screws up your water as long as the oil companies are getting a break. Then there is the environmental impact from things like hydraulic oil spills. That one back in June was a doozy. Is the driller, EOG Resources (formerly known as Enron) still suspended from operating in PA ?
Re: CAFE Mileage ratings... How would YOU react to 62mpg ? - Doc - 10-02-2010
lafinfil wrote: So what if it screws up your water as long as the oil companies are getting a break.
Exactly.
What's a little poisonous flammable tap water between friends?
Re: CAFE Mileage ratings... How would YOU react to 62mpg ? - Mac1337 - 10-02-2010
I salute you Colonel Drake. Riding to Titusville and the nearby Oil City is on the top of my riding destinations. This summer I went as far as St. Marys, just an hour away from Oil City. Take a break from all the subsidy debate and just enjoy this view,
Re: CAFE Mileage ratings... How would YOU react to 62mpg ? - RgrF - 10-02-2010
Once again our resident village idiot refuses to address an issue, he'd prefer to not see the forest for the trees.
Re: CAFE Mileage ratings... How would YOU react to 62mpg ? - Greg - 10-02-2010
My CVPI eats 62mpg for breakfast. And as I'm tired, and haven't read even a word of this thread...well, there you go.
Re: CAFE Mileage ratings... How would YOU react to 62mpg ? - Kiva - 10-02-2010
my jetta TDI can hit 50mpg...and fun as heck to drive..