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+--- Thread: It's all about Pakistan now (/showthread.php?tid=116367)
Re: It's all about Pakistan now - Carnos Jax - 05-03-2011
Michael, I can't say that "killing OBL in Pakistan directly follows from the policies and tactics started by the Bush administration." To start with, his policies were not focused on Bin Laden, as demonstrated by the Iraqi excursion (to put it simply). Who knows how many leads Bush did or did not follow up on. You may be right, but I have my doubts that he would have done anything with this one either due to that lack of focus/care.
Re: It's all about Pakistan now - Grace62 - 05-03-2011
michaelb wrote:
Grace, is your OP quoting from somewhere else? I don't agree with the main thrust regardless. In my view, killing OBL in Pakistan directly follows from the policies and tactics started by the Bush administration. Bush would have handled the situation in most likely the same way.
Obama did decide to take the high risk, high reward approach: going in with commandos on the ground instead of an air strike. But Bush would have probably done the same thing. This operation will be good for Obama politically, mainly because many had doubts that he would have the courage or conviction to pull it off. That doubt was of course wrong, and conflicts with what Obama has said he would do with this situation going back to the campaign and the debates.
I agree with the point about Pakistan: the future from here is mostly all about Pakistan. But this is a complicated, difficult problem for them, and it has been clear and will continue to be clear that Pakistan is not, and cannot be, consistent as an ally to us or in the opposition to Al Queda. All we can do is try to continue to thread that needle through diplomacy and other means.
No, not quoting from anywhere else.
The Iraq war was a diversion from the battle against al Qaeda and the hunt for OBL. I believe we could have caught him much sooner had Bush had a more effective, focused strategy and not done the Iraq invasion and occupation. The short term impact of Bush's foreign policy was that terror attacks increased all over the world. al Qaeda wasn't in Iraq before 2003, but they are there now.
Re: It's all about Pakistan now - Grace62 - 05-03-2011
Dakota wrote:
So can we go into Yemen now?
and do what?
Re: It's all about Pakistan now - Seacrest - 05-03-2011
kj wrote:
What it all comes down to is that Obama REALLY needed a political victory to help him out of the flushed toilet. Yay for him. All the rest of the analysis is B.S. that no one actually believes. kj.
Yeah.
This.
I mean, capturing and killing the "World's Most Dangerous Man™*" is child's play, and Obama waited until just the opportune time (between election years, sure, but during May sweeps) to pull it off.
That they were able to time the whole operation perfectly to coincide with Trump's TV show finale shows just how callous and cunning this man is.
He. will. stop. at. nothing.
Nothing.
*About that. Frankly, he was a shnook. Having the whole believe he was some cool evil cat roughing it in a hilltop cave, while all the while he's chillin' P.I.M.P.-style in Pakistan's version of Bubble Hill.
Re: It's all about Pakistan now - kj - 05-04-2011
wave rider wrote:
[quote=kj]
[quote=davester]
[quote=kj]
What it all comes down to is that Obama REALLY needed a political victory to help him out of the flushed toilet. Yay for him. All the rest of the analysis is B.S. that no one actually believes. kj.
I think it is your analysis that nobody believes (except perhaps that troll).
Riiiight. kj.
If your assertion is correct, timing the event closer to the election would have been more prudent. GHW Bush's victory over Saddam was too far in front of that election too leaving him a one termer.
After all, Obama had released his *real* birth certificate earlier in the week, wasn't that enough??!!?!!?
=wr=
Oh, I'm not saying it was staged or anything. It's just become pretty obvious Obama is status quo. This will elevate him for a few weeks maybe, but he's just status quo, despite what some are wishing. kj.
Re: It's all about Pakistan now - kj - 05-04-2011
>>The short term impact of Bush's foreign policy was that terror attacks increased all over the world.
I've never seen this assertion. How would you make this case? Just curious, but not terribly invested. kj.
Re: It's all about Pakistan now - kj - 05-04-2011
Seacrest wrote:
[quote=kj]
What it all comes down to is that Obama REALLY needed a political victory to help him out of the flushed toilet. Yay for him. All the rest of the analysis is B.S. that no one actually believes. kj.
Yeah.
This.
I mean, capturing and killing the "World's Most Dangerous Man™*" is child's play, and Obama waited until just the opportune time (between election years, sure, but during May sweeps) to pull it off.
That they were able to time the whole operation perfectly to coincide with Trump's TV show finale shows just how callous and cunning this man is.
He. will. stop. at. nothing.
Nothing.
*About that. Frankly, he was a shnook. Having the whole believe he was some cool evil cat roughing it in a hilltop cave, while all the while he's chillin' P.I.M.P.-style in Pakistan's version of Bubble Hill.
Just saying that Obama needs a little help, and this will help his image, at least temporarily. But some are acting like we finally now have proof Obama is a god (as they've known all along, even when they were being a fickle bunch). kj.
Re: It's all about Pakistan now - Black - 05-04-2011
Seacrest wrote:
[quote=kj]
What it all comes down to is that Obama REALLY needed a political victory to help him out of the flushed toilet. Yay for him. All the rest of the analysis is B.S. that no one actually believes. kj.
Yeah.
This.
I mean, capturing and killing the "World's Most Dangerous Man™*" is child's play, and Obama waited until just the opportune time (between election years, sure, but during May sweeps) to pull it off.
That they were able to time the whole operation perfectly to coincide with Trump's TV show finale shows just how callous and cunning this man is.
He. will. stop. at. nothing.
Nothing.
*About that. Frankly, he was a shnook. Having the whole believe he was some cool evil cat roughing it in a hilltop cave, while all the while he's chillin' P.I.M.P.-style in Pakistan's version of Bubble Hill.
Minor correction. The raid was timed such that success could be announced on the anniversary of the "Mission Accomplished" speech; the announcement was timed for the precise part of the Celebrity Apprentice broadcast that viewers care most about, the beginning of the boardroom shoot-out. It was not the finale.
Re: It's all about Pakistan now - Black - 05-04-2011
kj wrote:
But some are acting like we finally now have proof Obama is a god (as they've known all along, even when they were being a fickle bunch). kj.
Where are these people doing what you say?
People you overhear on the bus? Coworkers?
I have somehow not experienced one person enthusiastically praising Obama for the Bin Laden execution, on this forum or IRL.
Re: It's all about Pakistan now - Acer - 05-04-2011
Bush learned where he was in 2007, but the election was already over. The plan was to pass it along to the next Republican president for emergency use, but when that failed, he left the answer in a secret place in the White House. Obama finally found it. Also, Halliburton.