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+--- Thread: Chipped Credit/Debit cards: are they really more secure than old style swipe cards? (/showthread.php?tid=220048)
Chipped Credit/Debit cards: are they really more secure than old style swipe cards? - space-time - 08-29-2018
Most card have chips and in my experience 99% of retailers use chip now. I think there was still a retail place that asked me two swipe the card a few months ago but honestly I don't remember which.
Anyway, this brings up the question: Is there any evidence that chipped cards are more secure than swiping? I still hear about people's credit cards being compromised. And many places do not ask you to sign below a certain amount.
In Europe they had pin much longer, and as far as I remember, even back in 2000 or so they asked me to enter a PIN when I tried to use the credit card. When I told them I do not have a pin and I could sing the receipt, they were confused. eventually a manager knew how to handle that type of transaction. I think they were used to DEBIT cards.
In my experience here in US the chip just slow down the transaction. Sometimes there is a chip read error and you have to re-insert the card. Even when it reads the chip fine the first time, for some unknown (to me) reason you have to leave the card inserted until the machine tell you to remove the card ( and sometimes it makes that annoying sound). I don't the chip made anything more secure/faster/easier. But I could be wrong.
Re: Chipped Credit/Debit cards: are they really more secure than old style swipe cards? - Paul F. - 08-29-2018
It comes down to this:
What's easier for a machine to verify, a 4 digit PIN, or a signature?
I don't know ANYONE who has ever had to "verify" their signature for a credit card transaction, and in fact know people that just scribble on the signature screen, without bothering to sign it with their signature.
How is that secure at all?
At least with a PIN, it's checking against something.
I've noticed the speed of the machines has improved dramatically in the last year. Still slower than a swipe, but much improved over a year ago.
I don't know if the "Chip and PIN" is the cause, but credit card fraud in Europe is something like 2/3 LESS than in the U.S./Canada.
Re: Chipped Credit/Debit cards: are they really more secure than old style swipe cards? - Acer - 08-29-2018
I think the problem being addressed with the chip is duplicating a physical card with someone else's numbers. Easy for a counterfeiter to program a magnetic strip, harder to program a chip.
It does nothing for online fraud. Apparently in-person retail fraud is still the bigger fish?
Seems to me a PIN would help with the online part, but even that is just another piece of information that can be stolen in a breech.
Re: Chipped Credit/Debit cards: are they really more secure than old style swipe cards? - OWC Jamie - 08-29-2018
EMV cards add a layer of encrypted security at card -present point of use.
That old magnetic stripe had/had unchanging data that is fairly easy to read and retain for fraudulent purposes.
There is no added fraud protection when the card is used
Soon cards will no longer retain the magnetic stripe for late chip adoption purposes.
So yes, they are more secure but only address one method of fraud.
Re: Chipped Credit/Debit cards: are they really more secure than old style swipe cards? - ztirffritz - 08-29-2018
Planet Money covered the history of the chip a while ago:
https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2016/04/13/474135422/episode-695-put-a-chip-on-it
Re: Chipped Credit/Debit cards: are they really more secure than old style swipe cards? - bobinmurphy - 08-29-2018
I don't recall every having to enter a PIN when I used a chipped card for a credit purchase. Some stores still require a signature though. I may be wrong, but I think the PIN is generally only used on debit purchases which immediately take funds from your account, unlike credit purchases. An added benefit of a credit purchase over a debit purchase is the ability to dispute the charge, get purchase protection and sometimes even extended warranty.
Traveling in Canada I've noticed that most places only accept chipped cards and require a pre-authorization purchase transaction before proceeding with the sale which is a bit of a pain. Plus the hassle with MC and Visa being used in a foreign country (they insist on trying to make sure you know you're not in the USA when making a purchase), has me reverting to just use cash when I cross the border. Like I always tried telling them, yeah I know I'm in a foreign country and that probably explains the border guards.
Re: Chipped Credit/Debit cards: are they really more secure than old style swipe cards? - Gareth - 08-29-2018
space-time wrote:
In Europe they had pin much longer, and as far as I remember, even back in 2000 or so they asked me to enter a PIN when I tried to use the credit card. When I told them I do not have a pin and I could sing the receipt, they were confused. eventually a manager knew how to handle that type of transaction. I think they were used to DEBIT cards.
Europe has had Chip & PIN credit cards for decades now. So, yes, instead of a signature, they use a PIN with their CREDIT CARDS. Why we didn't implement this in the US when they rolled out chip cards, I have no idea, especially since most credit cards support a pin for cash advance withdrawals at an ATM already. It would make so much more sense.
Re: Chipped Credit/Debit cards: are they really more secure than old style swipe cards? - Speedy - 08-29-2018
bobinmurphy wrote: Traveling in Canada I've noticed that most places only accept chipped cards.
And your card never leaves your hand, they bring the terminal to you. This keeps the clerks/waitstaff honest. I like it, it should be that way here.
My card was refused when I bought a new computer on-line the other day. I had to call the cc company and they released the 'refusal'. I thanked them for their vigilance.
Re: Chipped Credit/Debit cards: are they really more secure than old style swipe cards? - richorlin - 08-29-2018
Yes, chip & PIN is the most secure. However, the majority of credit card providers are only using chip without PIN, which is not as secure. You can ask your credit card servicer to allow you to set up a PIN for your card. This is most important if you are using your card in Europe as most service providers in Europe require a PIN.
Re: Chipped Credit/Debit cards: are they really more secure than old style swipe cards? - space-time - 08-29-2018
richorlin wrote:
Yes, chip & PIN is the most secure. However, the majority of credit card providers are only using chip without PIN, which is not as secure. You can ask your credit card servicer to allow you to set up a PIN for your card. This is most important if you are using your card in Europe as most service providers in Europe require a PIN.
Interesting, I was not aware that you can ask to setup a PIN. That would come in handy when I travel. Thanks!