Does keeping an old car running "benefit" the environment ?

[Racer X]

I hear they can render down a '76 Buick Electra 225 and make 27 Honda Fits and half a Gold Wing.

[Black Landlord]

incognegro wrote:
do the old cars just go into a landfill?

Depends. Most get sold and driven a few more years. Ultimately they get parted out depending on the value of junkyard real estate, the popularity of the model and the universality of its parts . . . The most environmentally friendly possibility for mrbigstuff's car would actually be to put the car in the landfill and -not- reuse any of its parts to keep other cars running.

[davester]

That's a very complex question to answer and there are plenty of scientists out there trying to answer the question. The answer depends on a lot of different variables, like whether the new car is the equivalent of the older car, whether it is more efficient than the older car (this is definitely not necessarily true), what the assumed life cycle of each car is, how much of the car is recycled when it's taken off the road, and whether you are only looking at carbon production or also toxic air pollution.

Many people try to answer this question by trying to figure out how long driving an efficient car (e.g. Prius) would take before the fuel savings would be equivalent to the embodied energy it took to build the car (most estimates put this time period at between 1 and 4 years. However, IMHO this is a flawed concept, since they are only looking at a snapshot of part of the lifecycle of each car. Whole lifecycle analysis over multiple generations of car by segments of the population is the only valid way to answer the question of whether decreasing the proportion of new cars bought makes a difference.

My gut feeling is that maintaining used relatively efficient cars so that they last longer than their typical lifetime is the greenest practice. Inefficient cars should be recycled. Something that I find very odd is that many of the "greenies" in my neck of the woods tend to be anti-car folks, so they don't maintain their vehicles, which then pollute more, fall apart, and need to be replaced more often, which is about the ungreenest practice possible. These are the folks who tend to view environmentalism as a religion rather than a science.

[Black Landlord]

davester wrote:
Something that I find very odd is that many of the "greenies" in my neck of the woods tend to be anti-car folks, so they don't maintain their vehicles, which then pollute more, fall apart, and need to be replaced more often, which is about the ungreenest practice possible. These are the folks who tend to view environmentalism as a religion rather than a science.

Not that odd-- hypocracy comes in all colors, shapes and sizes.
My favorite is the old clunker covered in pro-environment stickers.
To an extent, though, these folks do make a difference by not supporting the auto industry by buying a new car every two years.
Bringing it back to my question above- does not buying a new car result in one less car on the road?

[mrbigstuff]

Black Landlord wrote:
Bringing it back to my question above- does not buying a new car result in one less car on the road?

ah, that is essentially my question. if I sell my car, it will end up in the hands of someone likely to drive it into the ground (it's not far away from the dirt now...) and that would be pretty undesirable. however, if i sink some cash into it i will prolong its life, perhaps to my bank account's detriment (and some mechanic's profit), but ultimately it will avoid a new car coming into the world.

[sekker]

Keeping an old, fuel-efficient car running with good maintenance is a great way to get maximum value out of the energy we already spent making that vehicle.

Keeping a 10 year old Hummer on the road does not make a lot of sense.

[kap]

I spent $1,500 on a new used engine and more on resurfacing the brake rotors, rebuilding a starter, repairing the speed sensor, fixing a leaky oil pan and power steering wheel. My car ain't even worth $800! Hopefully it will last me at least five years and help the environment somehow

[Black Landlord]

kap wrote:
I spent $1,500 on a new used engine and more on resurfacing the brake rotors, rebuilding a starter, repairing the speed sensor, fixing a leaky oil pan and power steering wheel. My car ain't even worth $800! Hopefully it will last me at least five years and help the environment somehow

Let's see:
-resurfacing the brake rotors: should extend brake pad life--plus
-repairing the speed sensor-- if this has something to do with fuel mixture--plus
-fixing a leaky oil pan-- using less oil in order to leave it behind on the asphalt- plus
- power steering wheel-- you'll effectively drive less with a steering wheel than you would zig-zagging all over the road-- plus
-rebuilding a starter-- cars are better for the environment when they don't start-- minus.

Congratulations! 4 out of 5, a solid "B."

[kap]

Hell, I deserve at least an "A" for driving much less since I have started commuting on bike and by bus most days of the week X(

[Black Landlord]

kap wrote:
Hell, I deserve at least an "A" for driving much less since I have started commuting on bike and by bus most days of the week X(

Sorry, I didn't realize this was about you :-)