What is Socialism?

[samintx]

Raid Medicare to pay for Socialism a quote from the Orange man.:RollingEyesSmiley5: I guess Socialism is a stand alone whatever.

[sekker]

The Orange Man is unhinged.

[Speedy]

Medicare is single-payer. The Veterans Medical system is socialism.

[cbelt3]

Per the Teapublicans, anything that brown / poor people get is socialism. Anything THEY get is the stuff they already paid for ! Because !

In reality, true socialism is a political theory that has been attempted in the 20th and 21st century but is quickly supplanted by dictatorship.

I explained it to my daughter like this:
"A government exists to provide goods and services to its citizens. The citizens pay taxes for that purpose. If it is the will of the citizens to support those citizens who are unable to support themselves, then the government will provide that support. "

In other words... if you have a SINGLE charitable bone in your body, you will support what Teapublicans call "Socialism". And if you don't... well, I really do hope that you change. Only rich jerks that inherited their money have never had moments where they need help from others.

[Sarcany]

Modern Western socialism is distinct from that of earlier in the century where it was characterized by antagonism towards capitalism.

It's a political market-oriented philosophy that promotes the general welfare and fair compensation for labor.

Capitalism and wealth are acceptable in this form of socialism, so long as the accrual of wealth doesn't result in abusive monopolies or mess up the economy with what amounts to choke-points of wealthy individuals who amass their money without contributing to society or who do so to society's detriment.

[Lux Interior]

Trumpers wouldn't recognize socialism if it snuck up behind them and seized their means of production.

Or reproduction in the case of the Orange One Himself.

[deckeda]

Making it even more fun, the notion of taxation is a variable construct.

For example, in our small rural county sales tax is 9.250%. Now, you might think that sales tax that high hurts the largely poor who make up County residents.

And you'd be right, except that they also reliably vote for representation that prohibits the sale of a large taxation revenue generator: wine and spirits. So, they are happy to drive 30-40 miles (at least) to buy wine, or across the state line where there's no tax on food, in order to keep their tax burden lower.

It could soon go up. There will be a referendum this Fall to consider a tax to be used expressly to assist in the creation of a new elementary school that will better organize the county and get rid classroom outbuildings because for some reason, the County is growing.

And then when finished the tax will cease.

And people are bitching about the sales tax increase, as if there's no other option for raising revenue. Sometimes, you just can't fight stupid.

[Lemon Drop]

Democrats want to "raid Medicare to pay for socialism"


this is a very stupid statement, hard to know where to start. the party that advocates for "raiding medicare" is the Republican party, who want to reduce entitlements so they can cut taxes.

More "fear the brown people who are eating your cookie" talk

I think he means that Dems want more money for Medicaid and/or Obamacare, which of course is health care for poor people or people at risk of losing private insurance. But I don't hear anybody saying rob Medicare to pay for that.

Medicare is in some ways a "socialist" program in that it is government -run; we all pay taxes to support a program that supports everyone over the age of 65 (rich and poor alike) and you can't "opt out" of paying for it. Where it differs is that the providers of the healthcare services do not work for the government, they are private, but they are reimbursed by the gov't at rates the gov't determines. So we have a socialized payment system operating within a free market system.

A more "socialist" system is Social Security. The capitalist version is the 401K.

[max]

Lemon Drop wrote:
Medicare is in some ways a "socialist" program in that it is government -run; we all pay taxes to support a program that supports everyone over the age of 65 (rich and poor alike) and you can't "opt out" of paying for it. Where it differs is that the providers of the healthcare services do not work for the government, they are private, but they are reimbursed by the gov't at rates the gov't determines. So we have a socialized payment system operating within a free market system.

A more "socialist" system is Social Security. The capitalist version is the 401K.

Quite correct.
One of the few times I agree with Lemon, that is what happens when she comments on a subjects she understands...

cbelt3 wrote:
"A government exists to provide goods and services to its citizens"...

Talk about getting something 180 degrees wrong.
A primary function of a government is to protect its citizens, to provide them a system of justice, infrastructure, coinage. I may have missed something , but that it is it for the reason people agree to be governed.
Then we decide how we want to produce the goods and services we need, anywhere from purely by private means, to a dull government control of means of production, but that is not the reason of government existence.. I do not need a government to buy a loaf of bread or a pair of shoes...

[sekker]

Government-based goods and services can be a form of security and infrastructure. Nothing wrong with that definition.