How do *you* test a hard drive's integrity??

[decay]

could it be RAM? run memtest - installed as optional with Applejack.

[Jimmypoo]

Have you tried pounding on the machine yet?

[RAMd®d]

I see SMART status about as reliable as software checking RAM-- that is I've found false positives in both, but when they say it's bad, it generally is.

Though I've never seen a false negative, mine are small data points to be sure.

[btfc]

Definitely check out the second user/fresh install/alternate system route.

[john-o]

Thanks everyone,

Good suggestions all 'round... I use the new user account technique a fair amount; definitely worth trying. Though, for me, there's not a lot of point in trying things like that when there are issues present when booted from an external drive. That, obviously, takes the internal drive out of the equation altogether, at least for some portion of the problem.

The machine is working much better after shutting down, pulling the RAM and swapping/reseating the chips. After further discussion, it sounds like the problems are more likely to appear later in the day, implying a possible overheating issue. We're in observe mode right now, with a few possibilities to explore down the road. Will keep you posted!

[olnacl]

Just went through a similar exercise with an external drive - after aborting a SuperDuper backup, I tried to initialize it using Disk Utility but got an I/O error every time. I went to Drive Genius 2 and it hung at 340,637,635 of 489,562,928 twice in a row. Had found 4 bad blocks to that point. I booted into XP and downloaded the Maxtor tools and ran the long test. It locked out a couple more blocks and returned the drive to me pronounced "passed." It's relegated to utility use now as I don't trust it, but I believe the hang in Drive Genius 2 pointed out that the drive isn't trustworthy. Just for fun, I'll run the Drive Genius 2 test again and see if it still hangs.

[Monster]

Love Drive Genius, but don't forget that the drive's manufacturer most likely makes a specific utility designed to test the drive, I try to use that too when possible.
of course it will be a Windows utility....

[ileneh]

All drives develop bad blocks over time.
The best way to deal with that is to:

1 BACK UP DRIVE - make a SuperDuper or CarbonCopyCloner backup

2. Do a LOW LEVEL reformat (the long one) -- that will map out the bad blocks.

3. Put your backup back onto the drive.

This doesn't mean that more bad blocks won't appear later - they will; but hopefully not too soon.

You can also loosely measure your age of use in a drive by locating the original specs.
Find the Average MTBF number (mean time before failure)
Figure out how long you've used the drive
See if you're near the drive's original MTBF.

By the way, the Apple Hardware test that comes with a machine has never been of much use for me. Always says my machine is fine; even when I know it isn't.

OWC ilene

[john-o]

Funny Ilene,

We're in agreement that all of these tools, from the SMART status to AHT, are of questionable value, at best!

I like your suggestions for managing bad blocks on an HD as it ages. What are your thoughts about this as we move to larger and larger drives?? Doing a low-level reformat on a 1 or 1.5TB drive, how long will that take??? And how about MTBF ratings for these huge drives, are they more or less in line with older drives? I haven't even thought to look at that...

[ileneh]

Hmmm....

Last time I did a low level reformat, I think it was a 250GB drive. I only have 1-1TB drive and its less than a year old, so .... I guess to do a low level reformat (with Apple Disk Utility), just start it and go out for lunch, nap, dinner.... LOL

I haven't looked into MTBF on my drives, because NONE of them are on constantly. Most drives last about 5-years. I usually get 8 or more years though, because I won't leave ANYTHING on when I leave my house. (OLD electrical system in an old neighborhood and I don't trust it. )
We could have brown-outs or like last summer, 2 transformers blew in the neighborhood. I don't know what company moved in across the street, but there are now about 8-transformers in the immediate area, and at least one blows each summer. I have surge suppressors on EVERY outlet and shut off, unplug stuff. It's a pain, but better safe than sorry!! ;-)
Other World Computing has a great green facility; but I'm 1/2 way across the country, in a town incorporated in 1711!!

OWC ilene