[Jobs]: Should I stay or should I go?

[M A V I C]

I've been working with a company for about 17 months. I was brought in to fix their design problems. They are a software-as-a-service company and have millions of users. It was a big undertaking. They had pretty bad designs. I think they thought, perhaps, that the task was a technical one, when it’s really more of a personnel one.

The root issue is organizational. It really has very little to do with what gets done in Photoshop or written in code. Most of the issue is well before that. So I took up that battle. It hasn’t progressed. There has been a lot of talk, a lot of agreement, but no change.

I tried every other option, but change is just not occurring. There's some great people here - some really great devs. They have become more and more apathetic. Even a newer dev was disheartened by the processes.

If change did occur, there would be a big upside.

We’re on what’s proving to be a very difficult project. Not because the project is difficult, but because there’s “too many cooks” and most of them don’t know a sauce pan from a frying pan. And now it’s getting even worse.

As most of you have probably noticed, I rarely quit at anything. So I’m having a hard time determining if it’s time to search for another job or not. I hate to give up just because things are hard, but I’ve been here for almost a year and half, and things have pretty much only gotten worse.

[Sam3]

Life is too short to stress yourself needlessly. It sounds like you've given it the best that you can, and it doesn't sound like the project will get moving any time soon unless you get a change in management. I, also, am a long-haul person, and am loathe to look for new jobs, but it sounds like in your situation, for you own and your family's sanity, it would be advisable to move on and look for another job.

Are there any managers above you that you can convince to streamline the process and get rid of some of the "cooks"?

[davester]

I haven't noticed whether or not you quit things. I have noticed that you tend to go against the majority opinion of those on the forum though, so I'll give my advice knowing that you might well do the opposite. Ergo...

IMHO if there does not appear to be a pathway to success open to you, it's time to move on. Ask yourself, what would a highly successful person like Steve Jobs do? He'd either change the situation so that he could succeed or he'd move on to something he could succeed in.

[testcase]

"I’ve been here for almost a year and half, and things have pretty much only gotten worse."

Sounds like you've answered your own question.

The main reason I would think you'd stay would be due to the current state of our economy but, if you know that getting another good job isn't an issue, get moving!

[M A V I C]

But should I really compare myself to Steve Jobs? I do ask myself that question, but then I wonder if I'm being a bit egotistic. And maybe that's a deeper question I find myself asking - if I move on is it because of my ego, or do I need to humble myself and stay?

[cbelt3]

If you don't see a path to success inside the company, then your best path is probably outside that company. Some organizations are toxic to themselves, due to bad culture or a group of intrenched bad managers that produce bad culture. Before you're too badly infected, find a new place where you can be fulfilled and successful.

And if you REALLY want to try.... use that new opportunity as a negotiating opportunity. You would not be the first talented technical person to kick an organization in the head and come out at the lead.

That happened where I work.... product development was inbred and intrenched. A very talented engineer wanted to see things improve. They didn't. He worked on senior management. He was rebuffed. So he quit. And was begged by the CEO, who saw the possibilities, to stay. Was given a leadership role. And spent 5 years kicking that department in the head until it was lean and mean and innovative. Then did the same thing at a higher level, and is now in charge of about half the corporation and a credible sucessor to the new CEO in five to ten years.

[M A V I C]

One thing about the culture here is that most people are actually pretty nice. I've been in much harder cultures. That said, I think they're too nice to some degree - keeping people in roles that are way beyond them. I hear there's changes to that, but they haven't happened yet.

They understand people want to spend time with their families. Amazon, for example, wanted me to commit to 60hr work weeks. No way. That sort of mentality is not uncommon in tech. I had a friend at MS and his manager was family-friendly. Then he got a new manager, and he was the complete opposite.

They say there's changes coming, which would give me a path to progress. But I still just don't see anything happening. For example, two weeks ago I was told some major changes would happen in the next 3-4 days. Not only have no changes occurred, but I asked about them and was told they're for sure going to happen, but not sure when.

[space-time]

I would have start looking 12 months ago.

EDIT: but, don't quit until you have a solid offer in hand. You never know what happens to the economy these days. Also I remember you were expressing frustration that you could not get health insurance for you kid a few years ago (before you go this job). I hope the current job provide decent benefits and you had health insurance for your family. I hope you find a better job soon and compensation is decent and you also get good benefits. Good luck.

[Speedy]

[deckeda]

If changes are coming, you deserve some reasonable assurance of a timeline as to when that'll manifest, and how. If you get that, and it's agreeable, you'll stay.

Absent that, or if it's not agreeable, start looking yesterday. Hell --- look anyway. What's the worst that could happen? You find a better job?