05-06-2008, 04:07 PM
Robert, your stance sounds an awful lot like "the ends justify the means." Care to re-think it? How can you simultaneously "hate" them and consider them universally a good idea? Who? For others? 
Keep in mind that despite the DOT logo on the invoice, this handled like a parking ticket: by the city's Finance Dept., and at no point is a judge or court involved, not even if you contest it. It's simply a bill to be paid.
Deterrent? Well, if you can't afford $50, but since your license isn't affected, violators stay on the road.
For the curious, this is the intersection:
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=nyc%2012th%20and%2057th&sourceid=mozilla2&ie=UTF-8&oe=utf-8&um=1&sa=N&tab=wl
The approach on 12th is heading onto Henry Hudson Pkwy, so the natural effect is one of a horse seeing the barn. 57th is a one-way onto 12th. This isn't a 4-way intersection and there's a barrier between north and south traffic; an accident from on-coming traffic, or traffic from the left is not possible. I'd be interested to learn how many accidents have occurred there. I'll bet $50 it's not a tremendous amount, but then again this isn't about safety, and NY acknowledges it by not trying to keep you off the road.
I'll probably check with my state but pay the $50. The odds aren't in my favor of even finding out any information anywhere, such as what's NY's yellow-light standard, and what's that intersection's timing?
Anyone NYC locals got a camcorder and care to film it, and include the timecode? If it doesn't last as long as NY's law says it should I'll pay you to send it to me. I'd far rather spend $50 on a tape and an hour of your time and postage.
It's interesting that if you get a speeding ticket from a cop, the ticket references how or when the detection device was calibrated. Not so with yellow lights. It's assumed.
Red light cameras are controversial. In some cases they reduce the number of red light runners (and as has been mentioned, if the yellow was shortened it's an empty victory), in some cases they don't, in other cases they increase accidents. What's not controversial is that lengthening the yellow has been shown to reduce red light running. Too bad you can't make money off that.
How many of you would be willing to wait say, and extra 2 seconds at a light instead?
Keep in mind that despite the DOT logo on the invoice, this handled like a parking ticket: by the city's Finance Dept., and at no point is a judge or court involved, not even if you contest it. It's simply a bill to be paid.
Deterrent? Well, if you can't afford $50, but since your license isn't affected, violators stay on the road.
For the curious, this is the intersection:
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=nyc%2012th%20and%2057th&sourceid=mozilla2&ie=UTF-8&oe=utf-8&um=1&sa=N&tab=wl
The approach on 12th is heading onto Henry Hudson Pkwy, so the natural effect is one of a horse seeing the barn. 57th is a one-way onto 12th. This isn't a 4-way intersection and there's a barrier between north and south traffic; an accident from on-coming traffic, or traffic from the left is not possible. I'd be interested to learn how many accidents have occurred there. I'll bet $50 it's not a tremendous amount, but then again this isn't about safety, and NY acknowledges it by not trying to keep you off the road.
I'll probably check with my state but pay the $50. The odds aren't in my favor of even finding out any information anywhere, such as what's NY's yellow-light standard, and what's that intersection's timing?
Anyone NYC locals got a camcorder and care to film it, and include the timecode? If it doesn't last as long as NY's law says it should I'll pay you to send it to me. I'd far rather spend $50 on a tape and an hour of your time and postage.
It's interesting that if you get a speeding ticket from a cop, the ticket references how or when the detection device was calibrated. Not so with yellow lights. It's assumed.
Red light cameras are controversial. In some cases they reduce the number of red light runners (and as has been mentioned, if the yellow was shortened it's an empty victory), in some cases they don't, in other cases they increase accidents. What's not controversial is that lengthening the yellow has been shown to reduce red light running. Too bad you can't make money off that.
How many of you would be willing to wait say, and extra 2 seconds at a light instead?